Mellk

Hi. I've noticed you canceled my little edit in the article. As I know you can read Ukrainian. There's the etymology of the word "shah" in the article in the Ukrainian-language section. I was just trying to remove unconfirmed information that contradicts the known origin of the word. All the best, Myrczyk (talk) 23:05, 7 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Please see WP:CITE if you wish to change this. This needs to be cited to a reliable source. We are not using sister projects as reliable sources. Mellk (talk) 23:25, 7 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

So where are the sources for the claim that shah has anything to do with the shilling? Myrczyk (talk) 23:29, 7 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

This has been in the article since 2005 and I have not seen any previous dispute over this. I have started a talk page discussion here. I think it is worth asking the creator about this first. Please feel free to add your input there. Mellk (talk) 23:48, 7 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Please patrol out the page. Thanks in advance. Myrczyk (talk) 08:54, 9 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Looks fine to me, thanks. Mellk (talk) 11:30, 9 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Not that I think it's a good faith argument but I was curious about the idea, so I checked Alsace. It has no less than two German names with three spellings. The city of Strasbourg has two as well. Strasbourg's is a more specific dialect, so I'm close to learning something. CMD (talk) 03:46, 12 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

They would also be disappointed to learn that there are strong German influences there as well. Choucroute garnie is a popular dish. Mellk (talk) 11:28, 12 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Interesting, I'll have to try it. CMD (talk) 11:55, 12 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Hi! How are you? Could you, please, explain your edit here towards Belarusian city, that has only one native name, which is in Belarusian, as it is in Belarus? At the same time there is no misunderstanding towards Dublin in the same conditions. Best wishes from Belarus,--W (talk) 12:23, 12 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

I do not understand your comparison with Dublin. Russian is an official language in Belarus and there is no consensus to remove such names. Mellk (talk) 12:28, 12 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Do you read and write russian ? I do. That the reason why i will undo the cancelling of my verified and verifiable contributions regarding

- the pix of the Constitution of the Russian Federation because: 

Конституция Российск��й Федерации = Constitution of the Russian Federation

- National emblem - Coat of arms of Russia 

please notice the double headed eagle was literally espoused by Ivan III marrying Sophia Palealog in the XVth century.

Thank you for understanding that facts and figures matter Cordi-Allemand (talk) 10:09, 19 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

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Hello, @Mellk, why did you deleted my changes in boyar article? This changes aren't relevant enough to require reliable source. Kievan Rus' and Muscovy are obviously different countries, so should be putted into two different categories. Бояри is the spelling used both in Ukrainian and Russian. Shahray (talk) 09:35, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

All your edits do not follow WP:V or WP:NPOV. Mellk (talk) 10:05, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Do you think "supreme Ukrainian rulers of Kievan Rus'" follows WP:NPOV [1]? Not even fringe sources use this kind of wording. Mellk (talk) 10:32, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Since Supreme rulers of Kievan Rus' quite literally named themself as "Grand Princes of Kiev"(Modern Ukraine), and Central Ukrainian lands served as core of this state, we can simply name them Ukrainian. Similarly how principalities of Moscow, Tver, Ryazan or Novgorod are named russian. Shahray (talk) 10:37, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

And which sources support this view? Mellk (talk) 10:38, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Support what exactly? If you mean the core of Rus', then here's a text in the Wikipedia article:"When the Varangian princes arrived, the name Rus' was associated with them and came to be associated with the territories they controlled. Initially the cities of Kiev, Chernigov, and Pereyaslavl and their surroundings came under Varangian control." Someone even tried to delete this quote, but editors replied:"The two sentences cited are supported by two reliable sources, and there is no reason to delete them. It is true that Kievan Rus' had more than just these three principalities, but it is also clear these three were the most important in its earliest phase.

About the map: The relationship of Novgorod with early Kievan Rus' is debated (Holmgårdr having a prominent place in Old Norse sources, while some suggesting Veliky Novgorod was the capital of Rurik's realm, although Rurik's historicity is in dispute), but in Rus' chronicles it usually was not grammatically or geographically considered part of the so-called "Rus' land" (Роуськая земля), in which Kiev, Chernigov and Pereyaslavl were the central patrimonies, while Novgorod had to pay tribute to Kiev".

If you mean the title of Grand Prince of Kiev, search for the article "rulers of Ukraine".

Maybe you thought "supreme Ukrainian rulers" means that Ukrainians are superior to somebody, but it really just means that princes that ruled in Ukraine were also supreme leaders of Kievan Rus'. So it doesn't changes the neutrality, it might be oversimplification but again, Novgorod is sometimes referred as russian principality. So it's not a mistake, but I think I used this wording only ones somewhere, how does this relate to boyar article or other articles? In boyar article changes aren't relevant enough to need a source, Kievan Rus' and Muscovy are obviously different countries, and there's few corrections in etymology, so if you don't mind I'll return this changes. For other articles, I will add sources later, but again why would this be such an issue if large parts of them are unsourced anyway? Shahray (talk) 16:41, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

The policy is WP:NOR. If you cannot find reliable sources that fully support such statements, then the statement should be removed. Mellk (talk) 16:45, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

So remind me again, how does this relates to boyar article or other articles? Shahray (talk) 16:59, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

You wrote some paragraphs explaining why 'supreme Ukrainian rulers of Kievan Rus' is fine based on original research and does not need a citation to a reliable source that fully supports this statement. I have already told you that your edits do not follow WP:V, WP:NPOV and now WP:NOR. Perhaps you should familiarize yourself with these policies first before you continue to restore these edits. Mellk (talk) 17:07, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

"Supreme Ukrainian rulers" isn't featured in most of my edits anyways, it's just that you asked, I explained. Are you sure it is original research, list of Ukrainian rulers? To other articles, of course, I will add a source and only then revert the change.

In Boyar article, I don't see where there's a need for additional source, and how "supreme rulers" relates to this? Shahray (talk) 17:39, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

There is no such term as boyar rada. Please start a talk page discussion instead. Mellk (talk) 17:48, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Before this change, it was called "Duma" which is an organ in Russia, not in Kievan Rus'. Rada is just a general slavic term for council. You can just leave it as Boyars Council. Shahray (talk) 18:00, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

'Boyar duma' is a modern term, but it is used in scholarship to refer to these councils. There is no such term as 'boyar rada' in English-language scholarship. Again, please start a discussion on that article's talk page instead. Mellk (talk) 18:02, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

Source? If it is used, then you can just delete a link for russian duma. Shahray (talk) 18:15, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply

"As a traditional institution, the Duma (meaning 'deliberation') had precedents in certain deliberative and advisory councils of pre-Soviet Russia, notably in the boyar dumas (existing from the 10th to the 17th century) and the city dumas (1785–1917)".[2] From now on, I will only respond on the article's talk page. Mellk (talk) 18:24, 21 September 2024 (UTC)Reply